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The strategy of God
Doing good: The shape of the Christian life (Part 1): Why we don’t
The broken marriage of preaching and pastoring
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Scott Tubman on "We are poorly dressed" - Part 2 (20/08/2008).
Ian Carmichael on Sola Gratia - Tahlia's story (20/08/2008).
Cathy McKay on "We are poorly dressed" - Part 2 (20/08/2008).
Gordon Cheng on An interview with Mark Thompson (20/08/2008).
Martin Kemp on The indivisibility of truth (20/08/2008).
Andrew Barry on "We are poorly dressed" - Part 2 (20/08/2008).
Scott Tubman on "We are poorly dressed" - Part 2 (19/08/2008).
Scott Tubman on "We are poorly dressed" - Part 2 (19/08/2008).
Alex Phillips on A freebie for you: Jonah in the ESV (19/08/2008).
Nicole Starling on "We are poorly dressed" - Part 2 (19/08/2008).
Recent posts
An interview with Mark Thompson by Sandy Grant (1 comment). Today we interview Mark Thompson... Mark, how did you come to Christ? I first heard the gospel … more
Sola Gratia - Tahlia’s story by Lionel Windsor (4 comments). Tahlia was born addicted to heroin, thanks to her mum Shae’s addiction. Tahlia (not her real name) lives with … more
“We are poorly dressed” - Part 2 by Nicole Starling (9 comments). Thanks to everyone who contributed comments in answer to the question that I raised in my previous … more
The indivisibility of truth by Tony Payne (4 comments). This Saturday’s classic Briefing extract is about the indivisibility of truth. It’s from Briefing #8, August 1, 1988: If … more
Dread, joy and Morning Prayer by Tony Payne (5 comments). Standing on the 5th tee at St Michael’s, in Sydney’s East, the golfer experiences a mixture of nervousness and dread. Here … more
A freebie for you: Jonah in the ESV by Gordon Cheng (10 comments). Here at Matthias Media, we read and recommend the English Standard Version Bible, the ESV, as a superior … more
‘We are poorly dressed…’ - Part 1 by Nicole Starling (15 comments). “We are poorly dressed… Be imitators of me.” (1 Cor 4:11, 16) “All her household are clothed in … more
Where’s your ministry ‘AT’? by Ben Pfahlert (11 comments). Christians and soldiers have a lot in common, or at least they should (2 Tim 2:3-4). Firstly they both know that … more
Countering Nowism by Lionel Windsor (2 comments). It’s been interesting to follow the comments on Tony’s post about the … more
The evangelical inferiority complex by Tony Payne (3 comments). It’s Saturday. Must be time for another classic snippet from the early days of The Briefing, this time about evangelicalism’s … more
Tony Payne
Tony is the Publishing Director at Matthias Media; editor of The Briefing; author of Islam in our Backyard, Fatherhood and numerous other Matthias Media resources; husband to Ali; father of five teenagers; and an avid consumer of books and almost any televised sport.
Sola Panellists
- Tony Payne (convenor)
- Peter Bolt
- Gordon Cheng
- Sandy Grant
- Gavin Perkins
- Ben Pfahlert
- Archie Poulos
- Nicole Starling
- Mark Thompson
- Jean Williams
- Lionel Windsor
Sandy, how do you understand the word “reverence”. I have been looking at various web dictionaries. My experience is that many people use it but don’t always mean the same thing. It is almost like it is a jargon. I understand that it incorporates the concept of fear, so I am a bit confused as the Hebrews passage (10:19-25) seems to be suggesting that we don’t need to fear God as we “draw near”.
Good comment, Greg. As I review my sermon notes, I see that I did not actually use the word ‘reverence’ except as a summary word right at the end.
I was really talking about worship as submission - taking the literal posture of the key ‘worship’ vocab - referring to prostration or ‘bending the knee’ before a sovereign - over into our whole life as our attitude to God.
At this point I did pick up on a critique by John Stott about our gatherings as often being a bit irreverent and casual, and lacking a sense of God’s greatness and awe. [Tell me if you want me to post the quote.]
I don’t think Stott was complaining about kids making a bit of noise in church or people not dressing up or that sort of thing, rather about leadership of meetings, which creates a bit of a culture where we are cocky or flippant or casual or mechanical.
And at that point I affirmed what Proverbs say that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.
You are correct of course, that reverence often has an overtone of fear. Not, I think of cringing fear, but deep respect for the power and majesty and goodness of the one we revere.
To trivialise by way of illustration, it’s the fear/awe I felt before a senior high school teacher: a very good teacher, an excellent sports coach, who could be stern and demanding but always seemed in control, even when angry.
This was a different fear from the fear many of us felt at another teacher who was also strict but had en explosive temper, but was not nearly as fair or competent as a teacher. With him, it was a cringing fear and not much positive respect.
You are also correct that Hebrews 10:19-23 encourages us to approach God with confidence and assurance and clean consciences - through Christ - and hence we do not need to fear his condemnation.
However the same author warns in the same chapter (10:26-31) against deliberately keeping on sinning after receiving a knowledge of the gospel truth, because otherwise all we will face is a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire. Knowing the gospel, and responding warmly but superficially, such that you count yourself amongst the people of the visible church, yet then despising Christ leads to severe judgment, such that the author says those sobering words,
Likewise, the author says in Heb 12:28-29,
thanks for the helpful article Sandy.
I have found that the two words that confuse and confound many Christians are ‘worship’ and ‘church’.
I wonder whether using the language of ‘corporate worship’ is more helpful in capturing that sense of reverence which Stott refers to. Part of his concern seems to be a ‘horizontal’ flattening out of God’s people gathering in a way that diminishes a reverent ‘vertical’ focus.
If what we do is ‘special’ than our language needs to reflect that it is not just any old meeting. It is God’s meeting, a gospel meeting,a special meeting, a worship meeting, but not just a meeting.
that ‘special way’ seems to be captured well by Colossians 3, where we see the beloved and holy elect ones of God living out the gospel to one another. They are united in love, ruled by Christ’s peace and the word of Christ is mutually taught and admonished. it is a wonderful expression of corporate, one another focussed, Christ exalting, word indwelling, worship. it is also the kind of worship that is very difficult to do alone, apart from the felloship of the saints.
you said ‘we gather together for church around his word’. would it not be more accurate to say we gather to gether AS church around his word’? or we gathering together AS WORSHIPPERS of CHRIST around his word?
I find it difficult to gather FOR church when we already ARE the church.
ie just as we are worshippers apart from being corporate worshippers, we are his people (his ‘church’) apart from gathering are we not?
in him , S
Solo Christianity would be an oddity
Or an impossibility? What do you think, Sandy?
Actually, the notion that “worship” applies to the whole of life is the result mainly of poor translation in English Bibles which conflates distinct terminology in Greek. The result is the NT uses the word “worship” to encompass both “service” and what many people actually think of as the definition of worship. The matter was discussed extensively on this thread which included some discussion of David Peterson’s book.
I wonder if starting a gathering with Psalm 95 actually misleads people about the purpose of gathering today, in the light of the cross.
Are we in danger of making the shadow the reality?
Is ‘church’ more than ‘worship’? I think so. Christ is central to our meetings and he himself is not worship. At best worship is our response when we hear him. God ‘speaking’ is central to ‘church’ but this isn’t worship is it?
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