Sandy, The Everlasting God is very useful not just on the doctrine of God, but also on the doctrine of Scripture and the sovereignty of God. (I find Broughton Knox’s chapter “God who is rich in mercy”, very helpful on the whole subject of predestination and election.)

Matthias Media will be publishing The Everlasting God as a stand-alone edition later this year.

Knowing God is a classic, of course. But reading The Everlasting God has the added advantage of bringing you into contact with the teaching of one of the great men who shaped our evangelical heritage in this part of the world.

Sandy you got me thinking.

What would be my ideal training program if I was the one being trained?

This is what I would love to be told…

Take all year and read through the Bible (several times if possible).
Hand in your notes as you wish with your thoughts on the following:
(emphasis on personal thought – not what others say about the Bible)

What is the Bible about? What is each book on about? How does each book fit into the overall scheme of things?

What did you learn about:
God and his word
The gospel
Grace and sin and me

What questions/issues have been raised in your mind?

Next Year…
What things will you explore when you read in your second year? (Scripture and reason? Gathering? Living in the last days? Prayer? Family/marriage?)

During the year, the trainer throws some questions and sees what comes back! Challenge me to search the scriptures for answers.

Then I reckon I will be better prepared to read critically – christian or non-christian books with a ‘scripture’ trained mind!

Di

PS Perhaps some autobiographies by non-christians in your list?

What about Tozer’s ‘Knowledge of the Holy’ for “Doctrine of God”.

It’s short. It is devotional in nature, but it is a very good ‘entry level text’ on the attributes of God and getting your head around the concept of the ‘big-ness’ of God.

I was given a copy by a Pastor/Mentor just before I headed off to Bible College in ‘89. As an 18 year old, it blew my mind in so far as the concepts it dealt with - but now adays, it is still a good refresher on the person of God.

Hi Sandy,

Great list.  Here’s a list of books we recommend to our appy’s. The first 3 books are more strictly in order than the rest.  We cover Bible/Doctrine, Ministry/Church, Christian Living.  We do tailor our list to suit the individual. There are more books than you asked for, but most of them are very readable (necessary for our context).

1. How to read slowly - James Sire.
2. God’s Big Picture - Vaughan Roberts. (Better written and more accessible alternative to G&K;). For more depth: According to Plan.
3. Distinctives - Vaughan Roberts. (Basic book on Gospel-centred living in particular areas of life).
4. Total Church - Timmis & Chester
5. Simply Christianity - John Dickson
6. Knowing God - Packer (Haven’t yet read your alternative, but hear that it’s great).
7. Know & Tell the Gospel - Chapman
8. Dig Deeper - Benyon, Sach
9. A call to spiritual reformation - Carson
10. The Pleasures of God - Piper

Future reading:
The Cross of Christ - John Stott.

Sandy, a few suggestions for you.

Justification: The God who Justifies (James White)
Piper’s book is really a response to Wright and so not as straightforward to read.

On Gender there is always the massive CBMW, Piper and Grudem edited “Recovering Biblical Manhood and Womanhood”. Brilliant compilation of essays on just about every issue raised.

For Doctrine of God I also like Gerald Bray’s “The Doctrine of God”.

For the Doctrine of God, how about John Frame’s title of the same name? I’m a couple of chapters in and don’t think it’s too stretching. (I am at a similar point to a MTS apprentice I think).

For justification, worth reading Wright alongside Piper? I don’t think many people would have Piper’s book down as a classic, and I think you need to have the Wright stuff clear in your head to understand the debate.

Still Sovereign is supposed to be good, challenging but not deadly.

In my opinion guidance doesn’t merit its own section, as shown by the lack of intermediate books? Suggest something on creation, end times or perhaps better, Christian epistemology, and how theology is done. Frame is an obvious recommendation here.

Not sure where it would fit in your list of 8, but the other book I would recommend is Call to Spiritual Reformation by Carson.

I can’t be the first to say that you have to have something on the doctrine of the church, so I’ll just say it loudly: church!!!

I think a meta-question is how much your topics need to be things that a typical apprentice hasn’t thought enough about before. Many of your books - great choices - but I’d hope that even if they haven’t read them, they’ve absorbed some of the contents along the way care of discerning plagiarists…

Hence, I can get in first with eschatology. And for this, I’d be tempted to point to Peter Jensen’s At the Heart of the Universe, as it also models the construction of theology and so theological method. And biblical theology, of course.

And I’d sacrifice gender off the list. Too much of the whiff of the shibboleth about it, these days, especially for an apprentice. I’d rather they got some solid Trinitarian thinking done, and talk through a gender position from that - far better than reading the cart that too often comes before the horse.

It occurs to me that Sandy has omitted what he wants to achieve with this reading list.  Is it preparation for college or is it to assist with their ministry now?  I assumed the latter—MTS is supposed to be practical—hence my favouring of Biblical Theology & guidance, because the trainee might need to correct people in these areas.  We also have nothing specifically about evangelism or prayer, which is odd for a bunch of evangelicals!

In Area 5, I think Chappo’s book on evangelism, <i>Know and Tell the Gospel</i> is brilliant - a must read.

In Area 6, I think Chappo’s book <i>Setting Hearts on Fire</i> and his video (only, not DVD) <i>Giving the Talk</i> are great for preaching.

For Area 7, training others, read <i>Passing the Baton</i> which I mentioned right at the start.

Commenting from the U.S., and not knowing if you want lengthy or brief, I would recommend these:
Gender - Recovering Biblical Manhood and Womanhood by Piper and Grudem. So helpful and foundational, and one doesn’t have to read the whole thing. Or a great little one on gender and the Trinity is Bruce Ware, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Atonement - how about The Atonement by Leon Morris or Redemption Accomplished and Applied by John Murray
Doctrine of God - Charnock, the Existence and Attributes of God. Its huge, but makes a good reference. Knowing God would be a great pick.
I would include in any pick Piper’s Desiring God. Call it spiritual formation or whatever, it hits on a number of key areas, including joy and motivation.

Somehow the post before I started listing books for the other 7 areas has disappeared into the ether.

In brief, I said that Ellen was right that I had not given enough info about my aim. It was to provide reading material above the general pop level theology as an intro to reading and thinking theology at a level suitable for Bible college/seminary.

In particular, it is for Area 2 of MTS 8 key strands (in 3 main spheres), namely:
Convictions (‘Head’)
1. Bible study
2. Thinking theologically
Character (‘Heart’)
3. Prayer and godliness
4. Relationships in ministry
Competencies (‘Hands’)
5. Evangelism
6. Teaching the Bible
7. Training others
8. Leadership

(Hope this makes sense of those other posts!)

Upon reflection, after picking up two copies at second hand booksales, in Area 4 - Relationships in Ministry - I would recommend Encouragement by Larry Crabb and Dan Allender. An oldie, but a goodie. And on the topic of marriage, I keep recommending Dave Harvey’s When Sinners Say I Do. Applies the gospel to marriage brilliantly.